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Ed
Joined: 19 Jan 2005
Posts: 21586
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 Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:51 am Post subject: USA Review - The Heretic |
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Disgust - The Heretic reviews the United States GP. Read the article here.
Then post your comments on the article in this thread.
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Julian Mayo
Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 15591
Location: Tying the antenna to the tallest tree I can find.
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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The last line says it all for me 
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Kapel
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 2778
Location: India
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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Can the teams sue the FIA in some way or the other. ( i know its like asking if some1 can sue the Supreme Court,not similar though)
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sgd
Joined: 06 Feb 2005
Posts: 971
Location: SoL III
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with the Heretic...
not as some ppl here sugesting strong penalties to Michelin teams... F1-lovers...     |
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Kapel
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 2778
Location: India
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| sgd wrote: |
I agree with the Heretic...
not as some ppl here sugesting strong penalties to Michelin teams... F1-lovers... |
NO one at this forum,a lot happened since u were gone,mayb u visited some other forums were probably u read about strong penalties for Michelin teams
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Byron Forbes
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 161
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Rules - 1 set of tyres for entire race, only 2 options.
Clearly, the bullseye option will be hit and miss. The backup will not be too much more conservative or it would be pointlessly slow.
All this makes for a small margin for error and with the track being resurfaced this has obviously been the cause of this occurrence.
The FIA has failed to provide testing here, at a track they know to have been resurfaced, and are now coming out and pointing the finger at Michelin and teams! 
What are Michelin supposed to do, turn up with Fred Flintstone wheels? |
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Kapel
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 2778
Location: India
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Byron Forbes wrote: |
Rules - 1 set of tyres for entire race, only 2 options.
Clearly, the bullseye option will be hit and miss. The backup will not be too much more conservative or it would be pointlessly slow.
All this makes for a small margin for error and with the track being resurfaced this has obviously been the cause of this occurrence.
The FIA has failed to provide testing here, at a track they know to have been resurfaced, and are now coming out and pointing the finger at Michelin and teams!
What are Michelin supposed to do, turn up with Fred Flintstone wheels? |
Ur still stuck at resurfacing,arent u 
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Byron Forbes
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 161
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Kapel wrote: |
| Ur still stuck at resurfacing,arent u |
That's what it all comes down too, no matter what anyone says!  |
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GhoGho
Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 1014
Location: 770
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 3:00 am Post subject: |
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| Byron Forbes wrote: |
| Kapel wrote: |
| Ur still stuck at resurfacing,arent u |
That's what it all comes down too, no matter what anyone says! |
Byron, I hope they never resurface your street, you might never be able to go anywhere safely again...... |
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F1greyhound
Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 505
Location: Prague, CZ
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 4:18 am Post subject: |
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Calm down my friends...........
the season has been excellent so far. The Bridgestones have been a joke at some races and now the Michelins were a massive joke at 1 GP. Too bad on this occasion, deliberately taken by the M teams, but unlikely to happen again.
Mr. Heretic, while you prove profound knowledge of the sport at times your comments re.FIA/Bernie/Max/improvement of F1 could be classified as cynical rather than constructive...
What would you do from the driving seat(FIA)?
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Byron Forbes
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 161
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 6:17 am Post subject: |
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| GhoGho wrote: |
| Byron Forbes wrote: |
| Kapel wrote: |
| Ur still stuck at resurfacing,arent u |
That's what it all comes down too, no matter what anyone says! |
Byron, I hope they never resurface your street, you might never be able to go anywhere safely again...... |
Well, if they did, and the bloke in the house across the street (who worked for Bridgestone) knew about a pothole I was about to walk into, we could rest assured he'd stand back and say nothing. The only question is would he laugh his head off or feel guilty? |
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Byron Forbes
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 161
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| F1greyhound wrote: |
| What would you do from the driving seat(FIA)? |
Well, interesting you should ask. I'd have had a contingency - chicane, all on bridgestones, whatever.
How about this question - which of the two tyre manufacturers do you want to be working at when the boss tells you to make the tyres for IMS? The one that shrugs their shoulders when you ask them for track data and hand you a pair of dice, or Firestone/Bridgestoine who hand you a handful of data CDs from the recent Indy 500? |
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The Qualiflyer
Joined: 19 Jan 2005
Posts: 27
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 7:08 am Post subject: |
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| F1greyhound wrote: |
What would you do from the driving seat(FIA)? |
Thats the real question. What would I do? probably nothing different to what was done. This was a left field issue that no contingency plan existed for and it had to happen to identify the possibility of it (or something else of similar magnitude) happening again.
We have learnt a very tough lesson and now we need to put escape clauses in place to remove the chance of it happening again.
In reality I doubt that anything would have satisfied, including a chicane.
Dispensation (and some penalty) to run different tyres would have worked..... if the Michelin shop wasn't closed!
With the benefit of hindsight and thousands of inputs there still hasn't been a solution offered that could have succeeded. If it happened again in France the outcome would undoubtedly be the same and nobody (even J Todt I suspect) would want to see that. It will take someone smarter than me to come up with an equitable resolution mechanism to write into the rules. |
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Byron Forbes
Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 161
Location: Sydney, Australia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 7:58 am Post subject: |
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| The Qualiflyer wrote: |
| F1greyhound wrote: |
What would you do from the driving seat(FIA)? |
Thats the real question. What would I do? probably nothing different to what was done. This was a left field issue that no contingency plan existed for and it had to happen to identify the possibility of it (or something else of similar magnitude) happening again. |
I disagree. I think this was very foreseeable. I'd imagine the teams would have pointed out the possibility of this as soon as being advised of the rules. In any case, it's very easy to see the potential for this outcome.
Even at a normal track, a good dose of rain leaving the track with maximum abrasion, an abnormally hot or even cold day or some sort of change to the surface, and suddenly you have no tyre option that will last for a full race. At Indy, this happened to coincide with a dangerous situation due to a potential catastrophic tyre failure that puts cars into walls. There are a lot of walls to hit after such failures at many F1 tracks!
The FIA are expecting everyone else to be prepared for all possible outcomes and think things thru so............................... |
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Kapel
Joined: 09 Feb 2005
Posts: 2778
Location: India
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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Byron,Every rules which have been stated by the governing body has a foreseeable situation.
But the teams/drivers/component manufacturers know about it and work towards it to achieve maximum advantage for its own team which would include durability & reliability.
Eg.A pit speed limitor software is designed for the cars to run inside the pits at a particular speed layed down by the FIA at the start of the season/race(changes at some circuits,i believe).
Now,TATA supplies that software to Ferrari,if it fails Ferrari would definitely get a drive thru penalty,now whose fault is it here???TATA's or Ferrari's??
Or mayb acc. to u ,its the pit lane which is to blamed cos it has mayb increased its pit lane speed limit.Though its informed Ferrari & TATA about it but didnt let them test there. 
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