The 2008 Italian Formula 1 Grand Prix Thread

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Driver of the day ?

Sebastian Vettel
15
100%
Heikki Kovalainen
0
No votes
Robert Kubica
0
No votes
Fernando Alonso
0
No votes
Felipe Massa
0
No votes
Lewis Hamilton
0
No votes
Mark Webber
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 15

Jim Watt
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Post by Jim Watt » Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:18 am

:bounce: This is Why I love F1 Racing :bouncec:
the drive of the day was Sebastian :1st: Vettel's without any dispute! :updown:

Lewis --before he 'cooked' his tires-- actually reminded me of Tony Stewart in NASCAR!! He certainly put paid to those who complain about not enough over-taking in F1! And it would be hard to say he was driving 'cautiously' to preserve his points --like some I could mention (including his colorless team-mate, the 'other' Finn) :oops: Early on Lewis was Flying!
And indeed, the commentators on Speed TV were oohing and ah-ing on every pass. :tramp: :bcomp: But, hey, they ARE, two of them anyway, BRITS, so we can't blame em too much. :lol:

I think the Italian TV did a pretty fair job of covering the leader Vettel. Compare their coverage to some of the races this year where Lewis was leading and way out in front and yet, from the pictures, you'd think he wasn't even IN the race!

And tho' some (including some drivers!) were irritated by Lewis's 'risky' driving, I love that kind of willingness to RACE --no matter the consequences!! And this is the first time I have really seen the lad show that side of himself ! In some ways he reminded me of Michael Schumacher's obvious delight in racing for the fun of racing. Some of the master's best races, as he has said, were not those he won, but those where he just dug in and raced!

And compared to Lewis, I have to say both Fernando and Kimi (my clear favorites these days) looked pretty ordinary :alright: In fact, I'd say they were not very exciting and I, at least, didn't see any WDC moves from either one. :drive:

Yes, Fernando did his usual wringing the most from an inferior car (tho' not nearly in the same class with Sebastian Vettel!) and yes, Kimi set fastest lap (when conditions improved), but neither one really made MY 'highlight' reels!

As to the Iceman, I sure hope the boys in Maranello don't change their minds about his new contract. And he'd better deliver SOMETHING BIG in Singapore or ... :light:

As to Fernando, I hope he stays with Renault; it doesn't look like he'll get an invitation from Ferrari and we know he'll never go back to McLaren, so the only other REAL option (leaving out, of course, the big bucks) is Sauber / BMW. But pairing with Robert Kubica wouldn't appear to be a good idea --even if Sauber really will be on a par with Renault in the new 09 specs, which I have to doubt. And as to the 'big bucks' option (ie. Honda) we've seen what happened to WDC Jacques V. when HE was tempted by money --he never was really competitive again.

Finally, returning to Kimi and what he had to say after the race: "This was a very difficult race for us. In the conditions at the start, as we have seen before in the past, we could not keep our tyres up to temperature and we totally lacked grip. I could do nothing but try to stay on the track hoping the conditions would change."
Actually this is pretty much what the Speed TV Commentators had to say during the race; that the reason Lewis was flying past everyone and Kimi seemed stuck was that the McLaren chassis appears to treat the tyres better in the wet than the Ferrari. And, I guess you can't blame Kimi for not pushing harder given what happened at Spa in the wet! :cry:

The Kimster continued: " When [the conditions did change], unfortunately it was too late to aim for a points finish. The car worked well but without grip, you're not going anywhere. The situation in the drivers' championship is now even more difficult, but I will continue to give it my best shot as usual." Quoted on Official F1 website 9/14/08

I admire Kimi's candor. He doesn't blame the team or the car; he simply lays out the facts: no grip no go; and tho the championship seems out of reach, he will drive as hard as he can till the end. :up:

I've looked around (at Speed TV and at Autosport.com) to see if I could find someone who can explain what it is about Kimi's driving style that doesn't appear to 'fit' this year's Ferrari. If any of you chaps have a theory I'm all ears. Could it be as simple as his race engineer?

I have to say now that it is still possible for Felipe to pull it out of the hat and get the WDC this year, especially with Kimi's help. But I have a sort of sinking feeling that Lewis will wrap it up in two weeks in Singapore and come out of it anywhere from eleven to five points ahead of the little guy.

Finally, it would be good for the sport if McLaren managed to overtake Ferrari this year for the Manufacturers trophy. Ferrari certainly don't deserve it this year: IMHP they are missing Ross Braun much more than they are missing Michael!

Enough. :drink: this is turning into a blog or something. :cheers:

Jim Watt :wave:
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Post by JayVee » Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:22 pm

Congratulations to Vettel. That was a superb effort. It was also a nice gesture from Alonso who was the first to congratulate him on his first win having taken the record of the youngest driver to get pole and win.

The race was exciting indeed and whether it was Vettel or Raikkonen, luck did play some role in the overall result.

Hamilton did look impressive at one stage in the race. Not at the start and nor towards the end but he should have been given a penalty for dangerous driving having pushed Glock on the grass and pushing Webber wide. That may look exciting to some but it was dangerous and shouldn't be tolerated otherwise there would be many regrets if a terrible accident results.

I agree with Jim on his comments regarding Raikkonen and Alonso. But remember that Raikkonen set the fastest lap of the race which means that under a particular track condition he was flying, unfortunately for him, that condition was at the end of the race. Under those same conditions Hamilton was being chased by Webber.
Alonso is clearly struggling with the Renault in the wet as if anyone remembers the wet race in Hungary two years ago when he went from 15th or so to the lead in a matter of few laps cannot question his wet driving ability.

I also think that Hamilton's performance is way over hyped. Most of the cars he passed had a lot more fuel than he had. I didn't see him make any spots after his second stop when everyone had the same tyres and the same fuel load.

I still think Massa would win the championship :wink:
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Post by jacfan » Tue Sep 16, 2008 5:39 pm

It was also a nice gesture from Alonso who was the first to congratulate him on his first win having taken the record of the youngest driver to get pole and win.
Yes I agree. It shows that is a true champion in every sense of the word.
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Post by Jim Watt » Wed Sep 17, 2008 2:47 am

:D Right on, Jay Vee (& Jac Fan)! Alonso's congratulating Seb V. was, indeed a classy move!

I guess I agree with Jay Vee about the dangerous moves Lewis made; the reason I say "I guess" is because the moves were photographed clearly and available almost immediately to the Stewards and yet nothing was (officially, at least) said. Given the fact that Stewards deprived Lewis (and I still say they did it unfairly) of a win in Spa, you could argue that these Stewards gave him a "pass" as often happens in sport when Officials fail to make a call or make a mis-call and "correct" it later with an equally blatant over-looking or manufactured objection. But I don't think that was the case.

And given that Lewis and Kimi have each, recently, pushed their own teammates off the racing line, it's hard to think of it as reckless endangerment when they do it to rival teams and drivers.

I have to admit, though, that I don't remember any similar moves on the part of Alonso. He, like Webber, is extremely hard to overtake, but he is because he is so good at braking and forcing the overtaker to take a different line.

I agree, Jay Vee that most of the cars Lewis overtook were heavy on fuel, but, unless my memory fails me, he got all the way to the front, so he got round the BMW's and the Renaults and also Massa and this, remember, was in the wet with very bad visibility and treacherous grip. According to his post race remarks, the reason he was slower later was that he 'cooked ' his tyres. In which case he, at least, took the blame for it.

I think he made it to second before he pitted? At any rate, during the time he was storming through the field everyone else, including his team mate, was more or less marking time and hanging on.

I have to admit that it was disheartening for me to see Kimi so 'flat' --and to see him AGAIN making fastest lap late in the race when it makes no real difference. I was, like the commentators, looking forward to a duel between Kimi and Fernando, but nothing like that happened. Maybe in Singapore? --But, alas, I'll be flying that Sunday and so I'll have to wait for the highlight videos. Enjoy the race!

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Post by JayVee » Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:27 pm

Jim, I think Lewis got up to second, some cars he passed on track others due to differing pit stops.

What I was saying is that Lewis was only 'good' during a certain window. Just like Kimi was 'good' during a certain window. Just the window for Hamilton was more beneficial.

Don't know how Hamilton managed to 'cook' his last set of tyres when he was one of the last to change them.

BTW: Funny how Kubica isn't really mentioned even though he moved from 11th to 3rd!

Singapore will be interesting!
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Post by Lloyd » Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:04 am

Good points people, always good to hear how other people perceive events. Me personally after watching the race live on the Teev and re watching a recording a few times (got to get a life :) ) think that Lewis got off very lightly with his ram & run them off the road style, mainly because the stewards feel he was overly peanilised last time. The penaltly was a bit too large for the offence and if they had of peanilised him this time (Monza), it really would have looked like a conspiracy against McLauren & Ron .. But his blocking and running webber off track towards the end when he diddnt have the pace because he had murdered his tyres was not like Massa and Kimi's fighting for position.
I hope as Glock said, that if he is in the same position again he wont yeild and takes Hamo out.
Hamilton if he were a champion driver and not just a fast kid in a good car, would not have worn out his tyres so quickly and could have still made it into the points. A champion is some one who can drive and know when to push and when to preserve his rubber.
It may appear I have not much respect for hamilton, but he has lost me with his attitude and arrogance of late. I did and still do think he is a good driver , but as we have seen so is Vettel. 8)
Maybe, perhaps, not sure

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Post by jacfan » Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:46 pm

Lloyd wrote:Good points people, always good to hear how other people perceive events. Me personally after watching the race live on the Teev and re watching a recording a few times (got to get a life :) ) think that Lewis got off very lightly with his ram & run them off the road style, mainly because the stewards feel he was overly peanilised last time. The penaltly was a bit too large for the offence and if they had of peanilised him this time (Monza), it really would have looked like a conspiracy against McLauren & Ron .. But his blocking and running webber off track towards the end when he diddnt have the pace because he had murdered his tyres was not like Massa and Kimi's fighting for position.
I hope as Glock said, that if he is in the same position again he wont yeild and takes Hamo out.
Hamilton if he were a champion driver and not just a fast kid in a good car, would not have worn out his tyres so quickly and could have still made it into the points. A champion is some one who can drive and know when to push and when to preserve his rubber.
It may appear I have not much respect for hamilton, but he has lost me with his attitude and arrogance of late. I did and still do think he is a good driver , but as we have seen so is Vettel. 8)
Beautifully said.
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Post by jacfan » Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:19 pm

Seven votes and all for Vettel..... awesome!!! :D :D :D :D Nice to agree on something. :wink:
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Post by Southernman » Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:54 pm

I voted Vettel as driver of the day as well. That makes nine out of nine. :D

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Post by jido » Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:22 pm

Voted too, I think Vettel deserves the Driver of the Day title.

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Post by mlittle » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:13 am

jacfan wrote:Seven votes and all for Vettel..... awesome!!! :D :D :D :D Nice to agree on something. :wink:
Ten votes now.......whoa! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :shock2: :shock2: :shock2: :shock2: :shock2:
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Post by jacfan » Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:13 am

Not sure I have ever seen 100% agreement on Driver of the day before. Awesome. 8)
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Post by Kapel » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:35 pm

Congratulations to "Baby Schumi" as he's been nicknamed for keeping(his cool) the heat in his tyres n the car on track to win the his first GP & STR (Minardi) :clap:

I'm quite perplexed that Hekki couldnt get near him,seeing the way Mclaren of Lewis was going..but i guess Lewis was more aggressive which ruined his chances to get pass Massa.
Lewis probably knew tht the stewards wouldnt dare to penalise him this time around with his fishy driving..and also he did get away with the other drivers keeping their cool and not ramming into him..maybe not for long
:wink:

I somehow dont wanna c this in racing..he was extremely quick and doesnt need to adopt this style of driving..hope he learns the hard way to respect other fellow drivers soon..otherwise like in nascar someone sooner is going to put him in the wall(hope tht doesnt happen though)

Ferrari's have completely lost the plot in the wets..this aint gonna help them in coming 4 races which are almost given rainy weekends..

Wondering if the Mclarens keep doing these mistakes with their choice of tyres in qualifying & Ferrari's cant cope up with rain...how close would Kubica be to winning the championship if he consistently finishes on the podium? :roll:

I'm off to Singapore GP...hope to have a complete race with a surprise winner :D
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Post by JayVee » Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:13 pm

I agree that Hamilton will soon learn the hard way. I just hope no one gets harmed.

Interesting observation Kapel re Kubica. Just like Raikkonen last year, Kubica may find himself handed the championship.

Enjoy Singapore, that should be a once in a lifetime experience :wink:
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Post by mlittle » Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:18 pm

JayVee wrote:I agree that Hamilton will soon learn the hard way. I just hope no one gets harmed.

Interesting observation Kapel re Kubica. Just like Raikkonen last year, Kubica may find himself handed the championship.

Agreed on both points......the way this season's going, it wouldn't be surprising if Kubica walked into the WDC a/la Raikkonen last year..... :shock: :shock: :shock:
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