Flavio Stealing from Ron Dennis??

[three-m]

are you kidding me?? see a common thread here?? yeah I think so and his name is Alonso.......this is rediculous

Renault summoned by FIA over ‘spying’ chargesThe FIA has requested Renault appear before the World Motor Sport Council next month over allegations that the team had unauthorised possession of confidential data belonging to rivals McLaren.

In a statement released Thursday, the FIA confirmed: “The team representatives have been called to answer a charge that between September 2006 and October 2007, in breach of Article 151c of the International Sporting Code, the Renault F1 Team had unauthorised possession of documents and confidential information belonging to Vodafone McLaren Mercedes, including, but not limited to the layout and critical dimensions of the McLaren F1 car, together with details of the McLaren fuelling system, gear assembly, oil cooling system, hydraulic control system and a novel suspension component used by the 2006 and 2007 McLaren F1 cars.”

The hearing will take place in Monaco on December 6th, 2007.

McLaren were fined $100 million and stripped of their 2007 constructors’ points earlier this year following a similar charge. They were found guilty of benefitting from possession of confidential Ferrari data.

3m

[Ed]

Thanks for the posting three-m

Indeed this is what the FIA have announced a few hours ago. What is interesting is that Renault are accused of having this information from September 2006 perhaps implying that if they are implicated, they may lose the title they won in 2006.

But given that the Renault had a significant drop in performance in 2007 while McLaren had a significant increase in performance one wonders if Renault did possess any significant information about the McLaren car.

So we have an appeal on the 15th of November and a hearing on the 6th of December (and no doubt an appeal if Renault were found guilty), this year's off-season will be filled with action in the courts!!

[Julian Mayo]

The Rumour Factory was spot on with this one
Perhaps Flavio was advised that he would have the Titles stripped if Renault won, before the season commenced

[three-m]

The Rumour Factory was spot on with this one
Perhaps Flavio was advised that he would have the Titles stripped if Renault won, before the season commenced

is it not all starting to make sense now boys????

More and more I am loosing respect for Alonso. He and Flavio are too tight and does it really surprise you that Alonso went over to Mclaren last year? The multiple sh*tstorm's were brewing a long time ago and I must say as sh*t become's unearthed it is clear that Alonso's position at Mclaren was more than just to win a title. Renault have tried playing off the "we're getting used to the Bridgestone's" a bit too much. Heck I remember back in '06 at the end of the year they were all saying that they were just trying to win the title and they didn't develop the '07 car that well. There are way too many people involved here who know way to much and did so long before any of this. And the same goes for Ron Dennis too. It's nice to see it getting exploited a bit now but the bottom line is this...if you're in F1 and you can get hold of someone else's info you're gonna use it or some derivation there of, and it happen's with all the team's all the time.
3m

[Ed]

Renault have issued the following statement following the notification by the FIA informing Renault to appear before the World Motor Sport Council

The Statement read:

Following the notification of the FIA for the ING Renault F1 Team representatives to appear in front of the World Council, the team wishes to clarify the situation.

On the 6th September 2007 it came to our attention that an engineer (Mr Phil Mackereth) who joined the team from McLaren in Sept 2006 had brought with him some information that was considered to be proprietary to McLaren. This information was contained on old style floppy discs and included copies of some McLaren engineering drawings and some technical spreadsheets. This information was loaded at the request of Mr Mackereth onto his personal directory on the Renault F1 Team file system. This was done without the knowledge of anyone in authority in the team. As soon as the situation was brought to the attention of the team's technical management, the following actions were taken:

• The information was completely cleansed from the team's computer systems and a formal investigation was started.
• We promptly informed McLaren of the situation and immediately after the FIA.
• Since then we have constantly and regularly kept McLaren and the FIA informed on all relevant findings.
• Mr Mackereth was immediately suspended from his position.
• The original floppy discs were impounded and sent to our solicitors for return to McLaren.

Our formal investigation showed that early in his employment with Renault Mr Mackereth made some of our engineers aware of parts of this information in the form of a few reduced scale engineering drawings. These drawings covered four basic systems as used by McLaren and were: the internal layout of the fuel tank, the basic layout of the gear clusters, a tuned mass damper and a suspension damper. Subsequent witness statements from the engineers involved have categorically stated that having been briefly shown these drawings, none of this information was used to influence design decisions relating to the Renault car. In the particular case of the tuned mass damper, these had already been deemed illegal by the FIA and therefore the drawing was of no value. The suspension damper drawing hinted that the McLaren design might be similarly considered illegal and a subsequent clarification from the FIA confirmed this based upon our crude interpretation of the concept.

ING Renault F1 Team have co-operated fully with McLaren and the FIA in this matter to the extent that the team has invited McLaren's independent experts to come and assess the team's computer systems and inspect the cars and the design records, to demonstrate that this unfortunate incident has not in anyway influenced the design of the cars.

ING Renault F1 Team have acted with complete transparency towards McLaren and the FIA, being proactive in solving this matter and we are fully confident in the judgment of the World Council.

[JayVee]

Alonso is the reason of all evil things it seems!! Next thing we'll know is that he pays Bernie and Max!!

Why and how can Alonso be the reason behind these spy cases ?

I think someone named Nigel Stepney and Mike Coughlan (two poms) colluded together and got McLaren in trouble. Alonso may have known about the relationship via de la Rosa but so did everyone else in McLaren (yes I am not naive to think that it was only de la Rosa then Alonso who knew)

Now this Phil Mackereth has some information on McLaren and takes it to Renault and how is Alonso involved ? Lets see, Ron Dennis doesn't want Alonso to go back to Renault so he presses with this case so Alonso re-considers. I can't think of any other reason that it has been raised now, it became public knowledge a few months ago.

If anything, Alonso is the victim here and Dennis wants to try everything in his power to unsettle him. I hope he gets a bit himself and the FIA start McLaren with -50 points or something

[Julian Mayo]

IMHO Mad Max was forced into investigating Renault simply because so many people OUTSIDE F1 knew what had occured. If he had done his job, this would have occured a long time ago. I am finding it relatively easy to muse that Alonso is not perhaps entirely squeaky clean, not that I am inferring anything, mind. Simply, it is something I find myself pondering. Unblinkered.

[jido]

I am finding it relatively easy to muse that Alonso is not perhaps entirely squeaky clean, not that I am inferring anything, mind. Simply, it is something I find myself pondering. Unblinkered.

lol agreed

[GhoGho]

Alonso is the reason of all evil things it seems!! Next thing we'll know is that he pays Bernie and Max!!

Why and how can Alonso be the reason behind these spy cases ?

I think someone named Nigel Stepney and Mike Coughlan (two poms) colluded together and got McLaren in trouble. Alonso may have known about the relationship via de la Rosa but so did everyone else in McLaren (yes I am not naive to think that it was only de la Rosa then Alonso who knew)

Now this Phil Mackereth has some information on McLaren and takes it to Renault and how is Alonso involved ? Lets see, Ron Dennis doesn't want Alonso to go back to Renault so he presses with this case so Alonso re-considers. I can't think of any other reason that it has been raised now, it became public knowledge a few months ago.

If anything, Alonso is the victim here and Dennis wants to try everything in his power to unsettle him. I hope he gets a bit himself and the FIA start McLaren with -50 points or something

JayVee, I will agree in that I don't believe FA is the culprit, but he has shown he is more than willing to use whatever means to get an advantage, and this certainly tarnishes his squeaky clean image.

As for Ron trying to prevent Alonso from going back to Renault, I don't believe this is the case. Ron could quite simply have refused to let FA drive ANYTHING for a year, forcing him to sit out a season. (Remember he prevented JPM from even testing when he went to Nascar?)
I don't think Ron is doing anything to stop FA driving anywhere in '08.

I do think FA is being very picky about where HE wants to be and how HE wants things to be (No. 1 Status with preferential treatment?).

Seems to me like his ego is getting the best of him.

[three-m]

all good points guys and i retract a bit from my earlier post in that in the heat of the moment i do tend to get a bit worked up LOL

Just a striking coincidence that these little F1 clouds of espionage seem to be following Alonso around
3m

[GhoGho]

all good points guys and i retract a bit from my earlier post in that in the heat of the moment i do tend to get a bit worked up LOL

Just a striking coincidence that these little F1 clouds of espionage seem to be following Alonso around
3m

maybe he is just a trouble maker?

[three-m]

all good points guys and i retract a bit from my earlier post in that in the heat of the moment i do tend to get a bit worked up LOL

Just a striking coincidence that these little F1 clouds of espionage seem to be following Alonso around
3m

maybe he is just a trouble maker?

hehe right a troble maker who in fact might be making enough trouble to get himself worked right out of a top tier ride hehe
3m

[JayVee]

Guys you just want to stick anything on Alonso

Let me ask you this, had the team listened to Alonso wouldn't they have won the Drivers' Title ? Alonso would not have made those blunders in China and Brazil. Simple

Yet despite the complete lack of support for him he nearly won the Championship.

Interesting you guys believe Ron Dennis when you choose. You take his word when it come to dealing with Alonso. Oh I forgot some are naive enough to beleive that only de la Rosa and Alonso knew about Coughlan's dealings with Stepney. Yes we should beleive every work Dennis says.

Think a bit and answer this, is there anything but what Dennis said that proves Alonso indeed wanted preferential treatment ? Is there any proof that he played dirty ? In fact in Hungary it was Hamilton who disobeyed some rotating order by which one driver gets the extra lap.
All Alonso wanted was equal treatement and he didn't get it from the British team that favoured the British driver.
And they got egg on their faces as they counted on a rookie to go the distance and ignored the Champ. Serves them right. Ron Dennis should quit.

As for Dennis preventing Alonso from driving, well I don't think he could do that besides he'll have to pay him millions anyway. And what about all the sponsors.

And all the talk about Alonso running out of options, I think whoever thinks that is smoking something. His performance in the McLaren from Hungary onwards is just proof that he is the best out there. And any team would dream of having him. He is just working out what his best option is.

Now go and continue slamming him. Alonso will do his talking on the track. He'll have a great challenge next year

[Julian Mayo]

Guys you just want to stick anything on Alonso

Let me ask you this, had the team listened to Alonso wouldn't they have won the Drivers' Title ? Alonso would not have made those blunders in China and Brazil. Simple

Yet despite the complete lack of support for him he nearly won the Championship.

Interesting you guys believe Ron Dennis when you choose. You take his word when it come to dealing with Alonso. Oh I forgot some are naive enough to beleive that only de la Rosa and Alonso knew about Coughlan's dealings with Stepney. Yes we should beleive every work Dennis says.

Think a bit and answer this, is there anything but what Dennis said that proves Alonso indeed wanted preferential treatment ? Is there any proof that he played dirty ? In fact in Hungary it was Hamilton who disobeyed some rotating order by which one driver gets the extra lap.
All Alonso wanted was equal treatement and he didn't get it from the British team that favoured the British driver.
And they got egg on their faces as they counted on a rookie to go the distance and ignored the Champ. Serves them right. Ron Dennis should quit.

As for Dennis preventing Alonso from driving, well I don't think he could do that besides he'll have to pay him millions anyway. And what about all the sponsors.

And all the talk about Alonso running out of options, I think whoever thinks that is smoking something. His performance in the McLaren from Hungary onwards is just proof that he is the best out there. And any team would dream of having him. He is just working out what his best option is.

Now go and continue slamming him. Alonso will do his talking on the track. He'll have a great challenge next year

At Honda?????

[Ed]

Ahead of the FIA hearing on Thursday relating to the spy allegations by McLaren, the FIA has requested the McLaren team clarify details reported by a journalist concerning the spy case.

The McLaren team has issued the following statement:

The FIA has asked us to correct certain factual errors contained in a press briefing given on our behalf by one journalist concerning Renault F1 and we are pleased to do so. The corrections are as follows.

In our briefing, we stated that there were 18 witness statements from Renault employees admitting that they had viewed McLaren confidential information.

To the extent that this implied that 18 different Renault employees admitted viewing McLaren confidential information it was inaccurate. 13 Renault F1 employees provided 18 witness statements and 9 of them have so far admitted they viewed and discussed the confidential technical information belonging to McLaren.

We stated that the confidential information on computer disks was uploaded onto 11 Renault computers.

This is not accurate. Mr Mackereth copied information onto 11 computer disks. The information on these 11 computer disks was uploaded by Renault IT staff in September 2006 onto Renault’s T: drive and then transferred by Mr Mackereth to his personal home directory stored on Renault's network server. A back up copy of the material on Mr Mackereth’s personal directory was made onto an unknown number of Renault’s back up servers/tapes.

Our briefing could have been interpreted as suggesting that the Renault employees who admitted sight of McLaren Confidential Information all viewed it on computer screens.

Only Mr Mackereth and Mr Hardie admit viewing McLaren Confidential Information on Mr Mackereth’s computer. The other seven employees who have admitted seeing McLaren Confidential Information admit seeing it in the form of computer print outs or hard copy documents.

We said that the information on the 11 computer disks taken by Mr Mackereth included 780 individual drawings.

This was an error. The information taken by Mr Mackereth on floppy disks, in hard copy form and by email amounts to 762 pages when printed out. The 11 computer disks included 18 individual technical drawings. Mr Mackereth also admits that he took hard copy drawings of McLaren’s dampers.

We said that the McLaren information amounted to the "entire technical blueprint of the 2006 and 2007 McLaren car".

This requires clarification. The position is that, the McLaren drawings plus the information in a confidential MP4 - 22A Specification document taken by Mr Mackereth constitute a technical definition of the fundamental layout of the 2007 McLaren car and the technical details of its innovative and performance enhancing systems.

We are pleased to assist the FIA in making the above clear in advance of tomorrow's hearing.